Monday, January 11, 2010

The Reform of the Reform - OR...

Katie Beaumont suggested discussion of this article from Catholic News Service, Papal liturgist endorses 'reform of the reform' of the liturgy (CNS, Jan. 7, 2010).


Please go to the link and read the CNS article taken from an interview with Msgr. Guido Marini, billed as "the pope's chief liturgist." I am not allowed to copy the article to this blog; though I would have liked to place the entire article here for you to read.

What say you? I expect to see many nods of approval. I can also hear sighs and groans from many of us who feel that Pope Benedict's "reform of the reform" is not necessarily heading in the right direction.


As always, I ask that you keep your comments civil. Did I really need to say that? Probably not!

23 comments:

Anonymous said...

What is the solution to the liturgical divisions in the Roman Rite? The reform of the reform crowd wants everyone to shut-up and stick out their tongues while the progressives want everyone to make noise and stick out their hands. There is definitely a theology behind the two liturgical styles. The Pope has one style and the rest of the Catholic world has another.

Katie Beaumont said...

It is interesting how the Pope exemplifies his recommendation that the priest should place a crucifix at the centre of the altar to make it clear that the celebrant is not “facing the people”, but facing Christ. I'm not an advocate or enemy of the Ordinary Form of the Mass ad orientem; however, there seems to be a hint at some MAJOR reforms to come long after the new English transtation of the Roman Missal is implemented. By the way, what is the diocese doing to prepare the faithful for the changes to come regarding liturgical music due to the new English translation of the missal?

Anonymous said...

Does anybody know when the "do not pour the Precious Blood from vessel to vessel for distribution" go into effect? I thought the liturgical directive is to pour wine into the vessels BEFORE it is consecrated, NOT after. If this is true, then why is this not the practice of this diocese? If it's not the practice of this diocese, then why is it still a widespread practice in this diocese?

WE CELEBRATE! WE BELIEVE! said...

i am so angry that this blog NEVER honored our modern day priest, prophet and king: mary daly. we lost her in january yet there is no mention of her. why is there no posting for those of us who follow the mary daly model of church? i am an angry eucharistic minister who has been told that all i can do is hand out wafers and wine but i can't consecrate anything. mary daly gave those of us who have been called, faith, hope and love. she didn't care about petty things like genuflecting, kneeling and all those other sanctimonious and theatrically pious postures. she cared about women.

Stu said...

More parody in the comments.

Katie Beaumont said...

Did anyone catch the Catholic Virginian's article on the new English translation of the Roman Missal? I realize the new translation does not change the Order of the Mass and I understand why the diocesan liturgical director would want to downplay the effects of the new translation by emphasizing that "the mass is not changing"; however,that depends on what one considers change to be. This is HUGE! It will definitely have a VERY noticeable impact on the way many of our parishes do liturgy. The impact on music will be HUGE. And that's just the beginning. One can only be but so minimalistic without eventually having to succumb to reality. To be honest, I do not believe for one second that Richmond diocesan officials and parish liturgical leaders are on board with the CDW and it will be interesting to see how successful they will be in their attempts to make Virginian Catholics believe that the CDW endorses the Richmond diocesan liturgical practice of liturgical minimalism. Either way, I guess this new English translation has kept our diocesan coordinator of worship so busy that she hasn't been able to address the tabernacle questions posed in previous posts as she had promised us earlier. I guess we need to have the Patience of Job if we're still waiting for a reply from Ms. CCD.

standing maryanna said...

Dear Celebrator/Believer,

wafers? wine? You are handing these out? And you are a EMHC?

If you would like to write a serious article about Mary Daly, I will be happy to place it on the blog.

Just send it to me at standing.maryanna@gmail.com

If any of the readers of this blog would like to write on a specific subject, please do the same...

As you can see, I do not always have time to place new articles on the blog... and I apologize for that.

standing maryanna said...

Yes, Katie, the new translation of the Roman Missal will have terrific ramifications for us. I am not happy about it.

standing maryanna said...

I doubt seriously that Ms Combier-Donovan will respond further. For whatever reason: tricky subjects, time-consuming work, her own work for the diocese; who knows whether it was requested she not write further. We really don't know...

Katie Beaumont said...

Standing Maryanna,
You may be right. Perhaps Ms.Combier-Donavan will not respond to the tabernacle question for whatever reason; however, the Pope is encouraging his priests to blog. He stated, "If people live in cyberspace, then the Church ought to be in cyberspace." He encouraged priests to use the latest technologies to proclaim the Gospel. How can this ever happen in our diocese when our own Bishop (DiLorenzo) seems to believe that bloggers are some how "fragile". No wonder why our diocesan leaders refuse to dialog with the faithful of this diocese. I don't think bloggers are fragile. I think our diocesan leaders are out-dated in their methods of proclaiming the Good News...not to mention UN-ecumenical when they project an attitude of aloofness to Catholics who take the time to ask questions and discuss current events and teachings of the Holy Catholic Church. Hopefully they will change their stubborn attitudes and positions on a host of issues. Anyway, if you're interested, here's where I found this information:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2010/01/pope_urges_catholic_priests_to.html

Diocesan officials need to get in on the discussions.

Katie Beaumont said...

Here it is again in case the url in my prior post did not work:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2010/01/pope_urges_catholic_priests_to.html

Katie Beaumont said...

Sorry. Try this.

http://www.tiny9.com/u/1124

standing maryanna said...

Katie, thanks... all three of the links work when copied and pasted into the browser... hmmmm, perhaps I need to turn something on, since the links weren't highlited. I'll see...

Veritas said...

What's there not to like? Does anyone remember the sort of nonsense we had to put up with in this Diocese not so very long ago? Here's a friendly reminder:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_J._Quinlan

Reform of the reform? Bring it on!

Thomas Howard said...

If you are trying to reach Catherine Combier-Donovan you may want to try here Facebook page.

Anonymous said...

every time we do eucharist, we become part of that oneness, central, and cognizant of our place at the table of celebration. the 'reform of the reform' is an attempt to bring us back to the time of pray, pay and obey. there was a time when catholics prayed the rosary during the eucharistic celebration. you can't celebrate and pray a rosary at the same time. that is one of the reasons why we eliminated the rosary from my parish thirty five years ago. we are church! some of the bloggers here are obviously ignorant to the fact that we celebrate community because that is what jesus taught us to do! celebrating community is not a bad word! some of you have been mocking the phrase and that is very sad.

Stu said...

Anon/"We Celebrate"...

You are a fake. Give it up.

Anonymous said...

you're gonna have to start coming up with some better lines than that, stu. you're so blinded by your homophobic, misogygistic ways that you can't fathom the fact that there actually are people who see things differently than your narrow minded version of church. open the windows again! the all male hierarchy is trying to close them on us! i guess i'm a fake for not believing like all the other ignorant bloggers on this site!

Anonymous said...

What concerns me most about the "reform of the reform" is they're trying to make us sing the Mass instead of sing during Mass! Liturgical music is about melody! NOT THE WORDS OF THE MASS!!! I don't want to sing the Mass! I want to sing during Mass! I think we should keep replacing the texts of the Mass with liturgical songs that sound better. What are we going to do when they try to push this new translation at us?!!!!

Stu said...

It's not a matter of having a "better line." I am stating that you are a fake and that your posts should be disregarded. No one believes the sentiments you put forth. They are simply too "over the top" for belief. You are, in my opinion, either one who actually shares beliefs similar to mine trying to stir up those here of a more undecided sentiment or a simple troll.

So prove me wrong if you can. Identify yourself and your parish. Not hard. One can clearly tell from my profile where I go and who I am. In fact, if you go to Saint Benedict's Chapel and tell people you are looking for "Stu" you would find me. So I challenge you to stand up for your beliefs in a similar manner.

Anonymous said...

shut up, stu. you don't know what you're talking about. there is a challenge as a believer in Vatican 11 as concerns the "fresh air" that was invited into our church. once the window was opened I do not believe it can be tightly closed again! That fresh air gave many of us a reason to hope, to believe and to worship in our own tongue, with more understanding and participation in the liturgy. It gave me a "road less traveled" as a young woman in the church at that time. I have traveled that road, with all its bumps and joys. we were made aware of our own baptism which called us to be "priest, prophet and king" because of modern day prophets like mary daly. the short term of john the 23rd, has done great things for me and a multitude of others in the church. We have recognized ourselves as adults and not so easily "spoon fed." we are church! we celebrate! we believe!

Stu said...

"Anon said...shut up"

Wow. Compelling.

My observation stands and your further posting without a clear identity only bolsters such.

standing maryanna said...

It's time to move on from this topic. I am closing the comment box on this article. I will leave the comments.

I would prefer not to delete comments but I will if necessary.